India - Yudhvir Singh

Interview Details

• Region: Asia - India
• Language: English
• Interviewee: Yudhvir Singh
• Interviewer: Olivier de Marcellus
• Date: 2022
• PGA Affiliation: BKU Farmers Organisation & National Coordination
• Bio: Yudhvir Singh, of BKU farmers organisation, and the National Coordination. Yudhvir Singh has worked full time (but without salary!) as coordinator of the National Coordination and was seconded by the heads of the BKU, the leading farmer organisation of North India, for over 25 years.
• Transcript: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/575jjj7p5u4775xcxa9ai/PGA-Oral-History-India-2-Yudhvir-Singh.docx?dl=0&rlkey=e9t5jlkyca8yhsk53euf2lotq

Transcript

Olivier de Marcellus: - So maybe we start. Can you, present yourself. Your organization and whatever.

Yudhvir Singh: I’m Yudhvir Singh from India. My organization is the Indian Farmers Union (BKU). Mostly in the northern part of the country. We have organization. We also have the Coordination Committee on the national level. In that coordination committee, we have several organizations from different states. That coordination committee was formed by Professor Swamy [ Prof. Nanjundaswamy, founder of the KRRS of Karnataka in southern India] and Mahendra Singh Tikait [BKU the principal organisation in the north]. So they created this Coordination Committee and they included different farmers organisations to fight against the capitalisation, against the globalisation, against the modern agriculture, chemical and other things. And it was started. So from the beginning I was a member of the organisation and then we came here in 1999. It was the first time we were in Europe, with the PGA Intercontinental Caravan. 400 people from India. They were in Europe led by Swamy and Mahendra Tikait. That was the first time for the Indian farmers that they came out from the country. They came to know what’s going on a global level. They came to know first, WTO, what’s the harm, and what’s the big agribusiness company doing to destroy their agriculture, their soil, contamination of water, a lot of chemicals. So at that time, we came to know the big companies. Some companies that are in France, in Germany, and even we were in Geneva.

So we demonstrated and we were in Belgium also in front of NATO headquarters. So that was first time the Indian people came to know what’s happening on a global level and what it is also related to the future of agriculture. They influence the agriculture and they are going to destroy the agriculture. That Caravan was an educational tool for particularly Indian farmers. So if it was not organized by the PGA, we people never came to know about what’s happening. We were in the dark. This was the first time we came to know about that. And I say it was an awakening in India. People came to know. And when we go back and we have knowledge regarding the current situation, we start a struggle in the country and after 1998, it is continuous with the same issue we got from the PGA Conference. We are fighting continuously. We are fighting against the globalization. We are fighting against chemical farming. We are fighting against pesticide and insecticide. And we have a campaign on how to save the earth, how to save the soil, how to save the water, and how to save the human health and environment.

Olivier de Marcellus: So so you say the Coordination started a little bit before P. When did you start? When did they start the coordination?

Yudhvir Singh: Coordination was started after PGA.

Olivier de Marcellus: Oh, it was after.

Yudhvir Singh: After, in 1998. It was in Hyderabad.

Olivier de Marcellus: Aha.

Yudhvir Singh: After PGA Swamy organized a national level conference in Hyderabad and all the big leaders, they were there. So when we go back and we have knowledge and so many Indian farmers and particularly the regional leaders, they were in the PGA Conference and they got a lot of things from there. Then we decided it is necessary to save the country, save the farmers, save the patents of the country. We got the knowledge from PGA. So we use it here on local level to save our agriculture. So it was formed in 1998 and it is continues.

Olivier de Marcellus: Because in Karnataka, the crisis, they had already been struggling. They had some knowledge, maybe the Swamy had.

Yudhvir Singh: He was before in Europe several times and he is also an educated and knowledgeable person. So he had knowledge and he knew about it. But before PGA, he was working against the local, but the campaign was not a country level campaign. So he was in connection with Tikait and several times he organized with him in Delhi. But after the PGA Conference, he organized a national coordination committee and involved several organizations, those were in the PGA, people from Maharashtra, Tamil Nadu, Andhra, Karnataka. But you know, several states he invited all and he created a platform to fight against all the issues. And still the struggle is going on. Coordination is working well. We have coordination between the movements from time to time. We organize the events in different parts of the country with the global issue, national issue. And sometimes we have a struggle with the local and regional issue.

Olivier de Marcellus: Yes. Because for us, for the others of PGA, the Indian Movement was was the great inspiration. It was Prof. Nanjundaswamy who launched the idea of PGA. So we didn’t realize that the PGA was bringing something to the farmers, Indian farmers. It was more the Indian farmers were bringing us this huge struggle and this inspiration and this example of, you know, of burning the GMO cotton fields and all these things that Nanjundaswamy had already started to do. So it was very useful for us in Europe, but we didn’t realize that it was useful for you.

Yudhvir Singh: But in our opinion, because it was our first exposure to come to know about the issues, what’s going on in the planet, and how they’re destroying the agriculture. So that was the first time for Indian farmers. Some leaders like Nanjundaswamy he was working and it was well organized in country after PGA Conference. It was well-organized and it was continuous, you know, in 99 we organized this Caravan, then in 2001, we organized a national level campaign. It started from Kashmir to Kanyakumari [l’extrème sud de l’Inde].

Yudhvir Singh: People from south to Mumbai, north to Mumbai. We gathered in Mumbai and we were opposing the export surplus dumping. We were opposing the dumping. So dumping ports in Mumbai. So we had a big demonstration in Mumbai. And in that demonstration, 71,000 farmers were arrested by the Maharashtra police, 71,000. So it was a big campaign.

Olivier de Marcellus: his was against import of cheap crops, of dumping?

Yudhvir Singh: Import for dumping. So and then we started to oppose the agreement on agriculture in the WTO. We were opposing and, you know, in Doha Round of 2003, the WTO would have been signed except for our [refusal of the] agreement on agriculture only. It was due to the pressure of Indian movement and Indian farmers.

Olivier de Marcellus: The Indian farmers pushing the Indian government.

Yudhvir Singh: The Indian government and the Indian Prime Minister. At that time he was Mr. Atal Bihari Vajpayee. The Indian Commerce Minister was not ready to sign it. Then there was a mutual understanding. He said I’m not able to… face the anger of the Indian farmers. It is against the Indian farmers, so I’m not able to sign it. So then there was a mutual understanding: you sign the round, except the agreement on agriculture. And still the agreement on agriculture is not included in WTO. It is only due to the movement by the Indians.

Olivier de Marcellus: That was only India?

Yudhvir Singh: No, not only India. A lot of other countries, you know, after in Cancun, G 33 was there. Several developing countries came together, but India was playing a big role, decisive role from the beginning.

Olivier de Marcellus: Yeah.

Yudhvir Singh: In so many Latin American countries or African countries and they were together. It’s become a strong movement. But the Indian movement was playing a big role in this.

Olivier de Marcellus: There was already Via Campesina in 98. No?

Yudhvir Singh: Oh, no. Nanjundaswamy was also one of the founders of Via Campesina. But the rest of the country, they don’t know anything about PGA or Via Campesina. First we came to know about PGA. After we organize there. The PGA had a small PGA conference in Bangalore after the Caravan, in 1999. Lot of people from Europe and other parts of the world, they were there. So it was a beginning of PGA up to that time. We don’t know anything about Via Campesina. We came to know about Via Campesina in 1999, when Thailand was the host for Via Campesina International Conference. It was the first time we came to know what we can in… Otherwise, we don’t know anything about Via Campesina.

Olivier de Marcellus: Because the first conference of PGA in Geneva was 98, February 98, and I think Bangalore was 99 and Via Campesina was there a year later?

Yudhvir Singh: After, after PGA.

Olivier de Marcellus: And after, in all the resistance to WTO, there was PGA and there was Via Campesina. What was the relation between the two for you?

Yudhvir Singh: Only one organisation, KRSS, was the member of Via Campesina at that time, the rest of the organization they are with, they know only PGA . So in 2004 BKU and some other organization became members of La Via, but not before 2004.

Yudhvir Singh: We organized a PGA Conference in Bangladesh. The South Asian movements, all South Asian farmers movements were in Bangladesh, I think.

Yudhvir Singh: It was in 2000 for itself.

Olivier de Marcellus: The Bangladesh conference?

Yudhvir Singh: South Asians before become member of the Via Campesina that was the original conference of PGA in Bangladesh. So we all South Asian country were there.

Olivier de Marcellus: And in the beginning I think Swamy was considered a bit radical too radical by some in Via Campesina. And thought that PGA was a little… maybe pushing farmers organisations to be too radical.

Yudhvir Singh: They were more it was more behind Swamy and his spirit.

Yudhvir Singh: Swamy died in 2004, in the early 2004, maybe in February. And yeah, and after that we became the member of the [Via ] commission after the death of the Swamy. Before that we were working with other movements in PGA.

Olivier de Marcellus: Yes. Because Swami died in 2004.

Olivier de Marcellus: The same year that I came to the forum.

Yudhvir Singh: I went to Forum in November 2003. [a forum held in parallel to the World Social Forum in Mumbai, which was boycotted by the farmers’ movements] That time Swamy was alive and he was in hospital.

Olivier de Marcellus: Yes, and I went down to see him because they told me, that I had to take advantage of that trip to still see him. So he lived a little bit longer.

Yudhvir Singh: After some months he died.

Olivier de Marcellus: Yeah. Yeah. I went to see him in Bangalore and he was already in hospital and. Yeah. Hmm. That was a big loss.

Yudhvir Singh: So in the beginning, from the very beginning, we know of the PGA and we were working with PGA. And there were several activities up to 2004. What after that? Slowly. I don’t know. So I was also in a PGA Europe conference? Mm hmm.

Olivier de Marcellus: You came to participate in a PGA Europe Conference? Which one?

Yudhvir Singh: In… After death.

Olivier de Marcellus: In Yugoslavia?

Yudhvir Singh: In Yugoslavia? No, there are. I think it was the last conference. And after that, several times I had a meeting with people like you and other people. So I know a lot of people are still working. And time to time we had a meeting. We have a meeting, but no activities.

Olivier de Marcellus: Not a general activity of PGA. I think that. What year was the. Do you remember what year was the one in Yugoslavia? I can’t.

Yudhvir Singh: Can’t remember either. Maybe 2005 or…

Olivier de Marcellus: Six, something like that. Yes. And the PGA still organized in Europe, for the summit in Scotland and then in Heilingendam in Germany, that was 2007, I think that was more the last time PGA was really organizing as a network.

Yudhvir Singh: I know I know a lot of people from PGA. They are working in different parts of the globe in several countries. I have the connection with the people, but I think some people, they are just… and they settle down because mostly they were students.

Yudhvir Singh: They were in university, they were studying that time. So some are becoming activists, they are working continuously in their own or they find out for some. Or maybe they settled down after completing their education.

*Olivier de Marcellus: Yeah. So yeah. So they, they became farmers or they, maybe they work in some progressive NGO or. Yeah.

Yudhvir Singh: But, uh, but we miss speaking.

Olivier de Marcellus: Yes, we often, I often tried to to make a new meeting… and a small one was organised in Haridwar.

Yudhvir Singh: Yeah.

Olivier de Marcellus: Well that was, I wasn’t there, I couldn’t go . I don’t remember why I couldn’t go. I know there was a small international meeting in Haridwar.

Yudhvir Singh: We organize it. We organize.

Olivier de Marcellus: That was. What year was that? Do you remember before 2004? Yeah. But often you, the Indian farmers, say we should continue with PGA. Henry Saraghi [Indonesian farmers leader! too, he also often said PGA is good, we should continue…

Yudhvir Singh: A lot of people, those PGA people from South Asia. They are all working together.

Olivier de Marcellus: I think also maybe PGA stopped working also because WTO was blocked, and because afterwards the Latin American people, PGA people, they were more working on the Free trade of Americas agreement. And then they were involved in national things - like taking power in Bolivia with Evo Morales, also in Ecuador. And so there was no energy for PGA.

Yudhvir Singh: So many people, they fought for the election and they coming to power. Yeah. In Nepal also. Also we also see in several parts. So we came to know people are now in the politics and they are in the government.

Olivier de Marcellus: And so it’s a good thing and a bad thing. Yeah… In Ecuador, they, they also took… got into a government and

Yudhvir Singh: Then.

Olivier de Marcellus: Then got out and yeah…

Olivier de Marcellus: Also people like Casimira. remember Casimira Rodriguez, the organiser of the Domestic Workers Union?

Yudhvir Singh: From Bolivia.

Olivier de Marcellus: Yeah, of the Union for Women in Housework. She was very much for restarting PGA. With her we tried also to recontact the Zapatistas, but still, there was never really the need enough to make it work again.

Yudhvir Singh: Yeah.

Olivier de Marcellus: That’s the way it was.

Yudhvir Singh: In 2000 when I was with you in Cochabamba. So Evo Morales and Casimira and others and so many people. But after some time, we came to know now they’re in the government and they are busy with their political job.

Olivier de Marcellus: Yes, you did. Did you come to other PGA activities, like in, uh, Prague? No, you were not in Prague. There was someone from India, but I don’t remember.

Yudhvir Singh: Who it was. I.

Olivier de Marcellus: Uh. We certainly learned so much from the Indians also because basically it was with Swamy and the Indian Movement coming o to Europe that brought the whole idea of civil disobedience.. For instance, we did the first Day of Action in Geneva and there were actions all around the world in 98, including in California. And afterwards in 1999 the Americans of Direct Action Network, they took the hallmarks and they blockaded Seattle. Everybody said the movement started in Seattle, but actually the movement started because of the PGA hallmarks and the examples of civil disobedience set by the Indian farmers.

Yudhvir Singh: Definitely.

Olivier de Marcellus: And that has made a lasting impact. Now you see the climate movement. They also do mass civil disobedience and it was proposed to the movement for the COP15 in 2009 by ex-PGA activists, who also organised a caravan of two buses of delegates from the Global South of the PGA network, who traveled through Europe from the WTO ministerial in Geneva to the COP15 summit action in Copenhagen.

Yudhvir Singh: Disobedience was the basic thing, the principle of PGA, principle of our movement and principle of professor Nanjundaswamy. Fighting in civil disobedience. We have a movement without violence. And you see now? The Indian struggle [ In the following,Yudhvir refers to the recent year-long siege of Delhi started in 2020 by the farmers movements which forced the Modi government to repeal four laws opening Indian agriculture to agribusiness. Not directly linked to PGA, but a fascinating account.] is longest and biggest struggle in the world is continuously 13 months, several hundred thousand, 300,000 people continuously sitting on road. It was the biggest thing, but is only due to the nonviolence. Several times government provoked for violence because if violence in the movement it is very easy to control. They took the action, they arrested and beat them. They fired and other things. But when we are not doing anything, we are sitting. So they were not in a position to forcefully do anything.

Olivier de Marcellus: Not when you are 300,000 only.

Yudhvir Singh: Yeah. All only thing is that if you have a movement, you have a principle of nonviolence. So you win. Definitely. If the people become violent. So government then they can manage it because they have police, they have military, they have a lot of things. And in violence, they are.

Yudhvir Singh: Can control anytime biggest movement in some time or some days. But if movement is with nonviolence, it is more dangerous. Non-violence is the strongest weapon for the movement. And practically, you see, we were there. We blocked the national capital for 13 months. It’s not a small period. Due to the principle of nonviolence.

Olivier de Marcellus: Nonviolence, and being able to mobilize so, so much, so many People.

Olivier de Marcellus: How do you mobilize?

Yudhvir Singh: Even we were not thinking it will be so long. But when we came and the government ignored us. So then we decided to go back. We send some people to the villages and they go back and ask the people, come, we need more strength. So we started to organize. Then we asked the people, every village gave the ten people. So first ten will come back and another ten will go, the number will be sent and those people staying in the village, they can look after the work of those that are on borders.

Olivier de Marcellus: To look after.

Yudhvir Singh: The struggle so they take care of the crops, of the people, those staying in village. They take care of the work, of the people,of those who are in the movement. So it is a co-operative movement and people help each other. And another thing is the local populace look from the villages. Every village feel it is our duty. The farmers are in struggle and they are sitting on road there. They need the food. They need the milk. They need the butter. Milk. They need the vegetable. So every village collect milk, door to door every day, vegetable, foodgrains and supply to the Delhi borders. So it is a continuous supply by the villagers. It’s 1 to 1 when people know came to know some village is doing this they adopt that and it becomes a chain. So several hundred thousand villages are sending food there. So a lot of people were eating there! Not only the people from the movement, the local community [near the road blocks] also come to eat. And no, nobody refused. Almost 50,000 people from outside the movement there. But today, so many kitchen amazing in the operation, 10,000 kitchens.

Olivier de Marcellus: How do you organize? I suppose today you can communicate with telephones or with email? or how do you organize?

Yudhvir Singh: Not using email. Telephone. We are using telephone and we have a network, organizational network. So movement have the structure down to village level. They communicate with telephone.

Olivier de Marcellus: You say from village level up, they use telephone.

Yudhvir Singh: Village level.Then block level. From block to district. District to state. State to nation. It’s different levels.

Olivier de Marcellus: Five, five levels, six levels.

Yudhvir Singh: We have a community below committee and then the subcommittee. After a district committee, state committee, then national committee.

Olivier de Marcellus: And how is the committee formed? the villagers they choose someone for for the one committee?

Yudhvir Singh: And then we organize the meeting and we ask the people, you form your committee for a village. Then we ask the block people. They come, they sit together, and then we ask them, you form your block committee. So it’s not a selection. It’s a selection by the people.

Olivier de Marcellus: Each committee chooses who they will send to the next level.

Yudhvir Singh: Yeah, yeah. And yeah, every committee has a meeting once in a month. They meet.

Olivier de Marcellus: All the levels?

Yudhvir Singh: All the levels, and they communicate. Decision this year on a national level. They communicate to the state president, who take parts in national level committee. You go in the street? He ask the district president. Once a month. You have a meeting. He communicate. This is a decision by Central Committee. He communicate to district president. Then District President have a fixed date for the meeting for district. He call the meeting of the district committee and he say all the president come in district district committee and he communicated. That is the decision. So it’s an oral communication.

Olivier de Marcellus: The telephone is just between two floors.

Yudhvir Singh: Mostly Oral. Mostly oral.

Olivier de Marcellus: Face to face.

Yudhvir Singh: Face to face. We spread it up to village level.

Olivier de Marcellus: So things goes up and down? The communication?

Yudhvir Singh: Yeah. But if any, any region have some problem, they organize a meeting, they communicate the district committee and then state committee and national. That is the way of working.

Olivier de Marcellus: And how was this mobilization decided? For instance, the first mobilization, that was the national committee that decided?

Yudhvir Singh: It was a long discussion and people, when we came to know there are three laws against the peasants. So we organize several meeting and we invite all the organizations, not only peasant organizations, also the organized labor organizations and others. We invite all, so near about 500 organizations they gathered before starting the movement. And we have planned to move towards Delhi. It was decided by more than 500 organizations.

Olivier de Marcellus: Not only farmer organisations.

Yudhvir Singh: And so many organizations, yes, maximum the participation by the farmers, but we involved them - the workers, the organizations, women organizations. All every organization was invited.

Olivier de Marcellus: They participated in the decision to move to siege Delhi. Yeah, that’s interesting because the laws were about farmers. But, but the other organizations converged with you too.

Yudhvir Singh: Yeah.

Olivier de Marcellus: To make the decision.

Yudhvir Singh: Yeah. They are also part of the decision making body.

Olivier de Marcellus: And it was important that they be involved.

Yudhvir Singh: We discussed with them and we decided together.

Olivier de Marcellus: Mm hmm. And afterwards, were they? Were they important? What role did they play afterwards?

Yudhvir Singh: Basically time to time we organize the general body meeting . All the organization attended and general body meeting and decision making bodies. General body. We have a coordination committee for immediate decisions, but all the decision approved by the general body.

Olivier de Marcellus: Which included the 500 organizations.

Yudhvir Singh: So the 500 organizations choose. 50 organizations choose one representative and sometimes two organizations choose one representative. So it’s like that. Not all five hundred, but about 200 people, they come.

Olivier de Marcellus: Then too, they were the ones who decided we continue or we stop or everything?

Yudhvir Singh: What is the situation? What’s the position of the government? What we need to do.

Olivier de Marcellus: but what were the organizations that went? because it was the farmers who were on the spot who were on the blockade.

Yudhvir Singh: Yeah.

Olivier de Marcellus: The other ones. What did they do? They make solidarity in cities?

Yudhvir Singh: Sometimes when we give the national level, they block the railway, block the road, demonstration on the street level. So all organizations participate.

Olivier de Marcellus: not in Delhi, but in other districts.

Yudhvir Singh: In Delhi, mostly farmers, some organizations, they have their tents and they have they have their presence, but not in big numbers. But they are present there.

Olivier de Marcellus: Because there were blockades, some things also in other cities like Bangalore or in no districts not?

Yudhvir Singh: But we give the call. So all states have action on that call everywhere in the country.

Olivier de Marcellus: Not blockade, but some demonstration or something like that.

Yudhvir Singh: Yeah, demonstration. When we give so many times from time to time, every month we give some action plan and every state and all the organization for law and password.

Olivier de Marcellus: Amazing. Amazing.

Yudhvir Singh: When we organised a tractor march in Delhi. Several hundred thousand tractors in Delhi.

Yudhvir Singh: Trucks, tractors.Tractors, several hundred thousand.

Yudhvir Singh: Tractors surrounding Delhi. So 10,000 tractor was in Bangalore, in Karnataka to support. Yeah. Very straightforward. Hmm. And we give the tractor march in every state here, we tractor march. All the actions… Yeah. It was a good experience.

Olivier de Marcellus: An amazing experience. Yes. Hmm. But you know, that was after. PGA. But do you have anything else to say about PGA?

Yudhvir Singh: Well, we feel that it is a space we need. PGA it is start again.

Olivier de Marcellus: We should start again. I would be willing. We tried several times to start the discussion again, but for some reason… it was maybe because we didn’t have Sergio …

Yudhvir Singh: So many people, they are busy with their job in this part of the world. And so many people, they are settled with their family and with their political job and other things.

Olivier de Marcellus: But also, when we started PGA, it was the only organization like that. Then afterwards, they started World Social Forum and others, many, many different.

Yudhvir Singh: Networks, a lot of organization.

Olivier de Marcellus: So things get you know, there is not the same energy going into. Then there was just one one way of of fighting globalization, it was PGA then. Now there are many different networks on, you know, on different subjects. And there’s Via Campesina and there’s so it’s more difficult to put people together.

Yudhvir Singh: It’s happening. It is a mentality of the people when you start something. So a lot of people come up and so many clever people, they think this is the opportunity.

Olivier de Marcellus: Well, also.

Yudhvir Singh: They are not, they are not taking, they are not behind the issues. They are just using the opportunity.

Olivier de Marcellus: Do you think we could have done things differently with PGA, better organization ? Probably one of the problems was that we wasn’t an organization, so we had no money, regular money. We had no regular secretariat. We had problems with the convenors committee. Do you think we could have done something differently at that level? Would have been better?

Yudhvir Singh: Basically moment to moment. Here’s somebody’s agenda and movement is behind the agenda. If you have good agenda and if you have agenda for the interests of the PGA and for the interests of the society, definitely people can listen and can follow.

Olivier de Marcellus: I agree. The agenda was very important, and the hallmarks. Yeah. The hallmarks that Swamy proposed, they were so strong, you know, they brought so many people together.

Yudhvir Singh: Yeah. You know, it was an example. It was never before and it was never after more than 400 people from the country continuously. They were in Europe and they had organized. And it is not possible. Without the help of the young people from the euro. They were strangers and they sacrificed their study and they organized and they are going to collect the money.

Olivier de Marcellus: They gave a lot.

Olivier de Marcellus: I think that Swamy when he met Sergio in the Hunger Gathering [a counter-conference against the FAO meeting] in Rome Swamy was clever enough to see that there was a real force that could… that these young people, could be inspired by the Indian example and by non-violence. And he put these together and it made a huge, huge… Yeah.

Yudhvir Singh: You said you said.

Olivier de Marcellus: It was the young people, squatters, also many squatters who did a lot of work and put you up when you came to Geneva or other places.

Yudhvir Singh: Said, yeah, some people have the idea and distribute. And it was a global movement. Everybody knows about PGA globally. So yeah, there was that time.

Olivier de Marcellus: Thank you.